ASK & DISCUSS INDEX

7 years, 6 months ago - Paddy Robinson-Griffin

Very much "it depends". Those roles aren't covered by Equity, they're more BECTU, and they're both "by negotiation" rates at that. Depending if you need kit, how long they'll need to prep, etc., could be £0-£500/day, say.

7 years, 6 months ago - Jane Sanger

It depends totally on the script - how many characters, locations, extras needed. The average short film of 5-10 mins length takes 2 or 3 days to shoot and to pay everyone properly and feed them would cost from £2-5,000. A good DOP and Director can be had from £200. The DOP ‘S price May include the camera and other equipment and if they have a very good camera like red or arri then it will be more. But any DSLR will be fine for a short. Don’t forget a sound person.

7 years, 6 months ago - Dorota Krimmel

Dear Paddy and Jane - thank you so much for your answers! Yes, that's approximately the budget I'm thinking of for this short film project - 2-5,000 maximum, although I think it would be closer to 2,000. Three characters ( 2 actors and me, equity minimum) , and 2 locations. 2 days of shooting, max. Probably one day will be enough, if well prepared and organised.

7 years, 6 months ago - Mark Wiggins

Nobody shooting a short could afford a DOP on BECTU going rate so it depends what the DOP will do it for. I do shorts because I enjoy do them and I like helping people out. Certainly isn’t the pay.

7 years, 6 months ago - Dorota Krimmel

Mark, thank you for your message and advice. I'm wondering, what if the crew is not paid BECTU rate, only some negotiated rate, but the actors are paid Equity minimum rates? Is it possible to do it? Would that short film be still considered an Equity production? I know how union and non-union productions work in the US (although only from the actor's perspective;), not sure about UK. Thanks!

7 years, 6 months ago - Mark Wiggins

In the USA they have Union and non-union jobs. This is not the case here. There are no BECTU rates for drama, only guide lines, as there is no pay agreement at the moment between BECTU and PACT. Although this will hopefully change soon. Its different with Commercials where there is a pay agreement between BECTU and the APA. So long as everyone is paid it is fine. Having said that, I once walked off an expenses only job when I discovered the actors were being paid. Actors are not more important the crew. Either everyone is paid something or its expenses only and no one is paid; neither actors nor crew.

7 years, 6 months ago - Richard Anthony Dunford

I wouldn't be too worried about whether a short film is considered an equity production or not. It won't have any bearing on being accepted to film festivals or getting good reviews and if you only have 2k you won't have enough to cover it anyway.

Plus if you want to use PACT contracts they'd charge a fee on a feature so probably would for a short too.

7 years, 6 months ago - Dorota Krimmel

Thank you for your answers! Mark - I've never said that the actors would be paid and crew not paid. I only said that I would like to use Equity actors ; I would never make a project with unpaid crew - we were only discussing the situation when the actors are under equity contracts, but the crew is paid 'non-union' negotiated rate. Richard - thank you for your answer- well, I don't know, I just wanted to have an Equity production - as an actress, I'm bored of working non-union, but , if it really doesn't matter if the film is union or non-union in the UK, then I might reconsider my plan ;) I didn't say I have only 2k, I'm just trying to decide on a reasonable budget, not too low, not too high , to have a nice short film well made.

7 years, 6 months ago - Paddy Robinson-Griffin

As the topic expands a bit, I hope the following is useful -

To be an Equity film, you do not deal direct with Equity, you deal with PACT who negotiated the PACT/Equity contracts to begin with, bargained collectively over decades by both sides. The Equity agreement will require the cast fees to be placed in escrow, which PACT will arrange and hold for you, as a member. That means paying your PACT membership levy (certainly for a feature - it's £2000+). That then allows you to use the PACT/Equity contracts and binds you to the terms thereof. The terms run to about 70 pages of dense print which was negotiated over decades by lawyers. It invokes all kinds of clauses around credits, pensions, holiday pay, usage fees, etc. Basically it is total overkill for a short film!

I would suggest you just offer a fair price all round, promise to treat everyone well, and you'll get cast (and crew) non-union. You could try calling Elouise West at PACT, although she's a busy woman she is very helpful, however I really would suggest you don't encumber yourself with the PACT/Equity contracts and formalities.

If you have questions I'm happy to help, but I think I caught the essence above :)

7 years, 6 months ago - Mark Wiggins

Hi Dorota. I never said that you were planning to pay actors and not crew. It was just an antecdote; nothing more. :)

7 years, 6 months ago - Dorota Krimmel

Paddy - thank you so much for your great answer!:) Well, I did think it over and I agree, it doesn't seem to be a good idea, as you suggest, to go for the Equity agreement for a short film like this. Maybe I'll do it for my next film.
I'm still polishing my script at the moment so I will make my final production decisions later.
Thank you all for your great advices, it was really helpful! :)

Mark, that's all right;)

7 years, 6 months ago - Hedley England

Hi Dorota,
I've made shorts and showreels for actors and writers, working with a professional cameraman, and the deal usually was a cash agreement at a meeting in the pub, with the lynch pin being the cameraman who has to not only supply the agreed kit, but the transport to get it to the location, and then somewhere to park. We do this for the love of it, and as it's not a broadcast job, we don't charge the proper rate. You'd be an actor/producer, and your budget if around 2k is quite good, but allow 5 mins a day maximum on simple setups. Getting everyone together on the same day, and a booked location etc can be challenging on these small budgets.

7 years, 6 months ago - Paddy Robinson-Griffin

I think that's a smart move Dorota, it's just not appropriate at this scale or really until you're spending a maybe half a million or more.