ASK & DISCUSS
INDEXVFX/Effects advice for stabbing in Wide Shot
3 years, 6 months ago - Simon Brooke
Hi Shooters!
I'm making a short film with a modest budget, and I want to briefly show one person stabbing a knife into another character's bare midriff in a wide shot. I'm not sure where to start, or what kind of person I should be looking for?
The obvious idea is to have a prop knife with a retractable tip, but I have read many articles that they aren't safe (in case they jam), and actor safety is paramount.
I was thinking perhaps it could be achieved through a small amount of SFX or compositing with one character stabbing into an object and then comping the other actor back in, but I was wondering how realistic this is on a very small budget?
I'd be so grateful for any advice anyone might be able to give me, if you know anyone who might be up to the challenge, or if you've filmed anything similar...
Thanks, Shooters!
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3 years, 6 months ago - James McCann
It might not be what you're after, but implication can be more powerful than showing.
Cut right before the blade enters, show stabee's face, cut straight back to bloody blade being pulled away.
Do it quickly enough and you'll get the impact of the stabbing.
Response from 3 years, 6 months ago - James McCann SHOW
3 years, 6 months ago - Simon Brooke
Thanks James. I think that will be the last resort. It's difficult to explain without going into detail, but it won't be expected in he wide shot, and I wamt it to be a surprise. We will immediately cut to the stabbee's face, but I want the audience to think it's surely not going to happen, and then you see it, graphically.
Response from 3 years, 6 months ago - Simon Brooke SHOW
3 years, 6 months ago - Joe Golby
Doing a comp of two takes is never great when the two things have to physically interact. Doing that you could take it right up to the very moment, then as James suggests cut to the reaction. It will feel like we've seen it but haven't
A very common way now that requires some VFX skill/expense would be to do a blade replacement, you'd have the handle or a rubber knife with 2/3 cut off. See this good example from The Witcher
https://youtu.be/fqlUWWg6aYo?t=74
joegobly.com (Fight Choreographer)
Response from 3 years, 6 months ago - Joe Golby SHOW
3 years, 6 months ago - Simon Brooke
Thanks Joe, that's super helpful!
How does this sound as a possibility? - Using a rubber knife with a cut off, pressed against the stabee's abdomen, having the stabber pull it away, reversing the footage, and comping the tip of the knife in?
Thanks for the help!
Response from 3 years, 6 months ago - Simon Brooke SHOW
3 years, 6 months ago - Ronnie Mackintosh
Interesting possibility from Film Riot site https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjjKTIV31o0. Another simpler option could be to copy Hitchcock's Psycho shower scene where he filmed it in reverse - the tip of the blade pressing in against flesh then pulling it back and reversing the shot.
Response from 3 years, 6 months ago - Ronnie Mackintosh SHOW
3 years, 6 months ago - Joe Golby
There's no reason a reversed shot shouldn't work from a technical perspective.
Given what you're after, a wide of the stabbing, reverse footage can look odd due to body movement not being exactly as it shoudl. Reactions are what sell moves such as stabs punches etc and performing it well, backward, will be hard. The same goes for the lead-in. You may find it works for the blade going in but not a lot on either side.
Nice tutorial found by Ronnie.
Response from 3 years, 6 months ago - Joe Golby SHOW