ASK & DISCUSS INDEX

10 years, 11 months ago - Ian Kennedy

Thanks guys, keep the responses coming, all good ideas which I'll pass on. For obvious reasons I'm not going to chat just yet about what the app would actually do but it's a lot more advanced than flowcharts, index cards etc - if it didn't add a new dimension to writing development then I wouldn't be bothering. Up until now, actually writing stuff (whether on computer or paper or sticky notes) and then reading and responding to it has been the primary way to develop it, but that leaves us all at risk of personal blind spots.

10 years, 11 months ago - Peter Spencer

Would have to be pretty darn good and cheap to move me away from Fade In app m(£2.99) and CELTX INDEX CARDS app (free)

10 years, 12 months ago - D. James Newton

Have you surveyed writers to find out what they want from an APP?

There's a book - somewhere - called How I Write which details the process of a large number of writers with photographs.

What struck me about the writers is how they all have a different way of doing things.

I know this is true from experience too...and the writers I have worked with.

Personally I write long form by hand on yellow legal pads, use scapple to brainstorm/plan out beats and sequences and then edit as I type up into Final Draft.
I've yet to meet anyone who has the same process as me.
And have you seen how Oscar Winning Writer Dustin Lance Black writes?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrvawtrRxsw

Why do you assume you can get writers to conform to the narrow parameters of process that is offered by your APP?

10 years, 11 months ago - Ian Kennedy

So, the developers and I are agreed that it should be a 'web app' (ie, cross-compatible and web-based) rather than based on specific platforms. We've got a sensible quote together and the next thing is to decide if, how and when to make the investment. I'll get looking into how to raise the finance, in the meantime if anyone would like to express an interest or give further suggestions then do keep posting on here. Thanks for all the input so far.

10 years, 12 months ago - D. James Newton

I'm an iOS user - if that answers the question.
And I've yet to pay more than £9.99 for an APP.

I guess I don't really understand what your APP does, hence my scepticism.

10 years, 11 months ago - Ian Kennedy

Almost $200 in fact. Final Draft not cheap either but has some useful tools for story development; as you say Franz I'm not sure anyone would write substantial parts of their script on the mobile version.

10 years, 11 months ago - Ian Kennedy

Thanks Fiona, good to know!

10 years, 11 months ago - Charles Harris

Ian, this all sounds very interesting. I believe:

1. You'd need the app to integrate easily with every available platform. Many writers write a bit here and there, sometimes wanting to use the phone, sometimes the desktop. I use, and love, Scrivener, but am frustrated that I can't sync my windows computer version with my iPad. It's crucial that, as Marlom says, you don't have to enter data twice (or more!)

2. For the same reason, it would be important to me that it would sync with whatever I wanted to write the script with. Writers generally move to and fro, from plan to script and back again.

3. Price? I agree that today you absolutely have to offer a free trial of some kind.

Look at the direct competition. FD, etc, charge a load more, because you absolutely have to format a script and work with producers who expect pro writers to have the software. Scrivener doesn't offer that, but does offer a one-stop shop for everything from first idea, to research materials, to final polish.

Given that screenwriters have survived 100+ years without your app, many will assume that they can continue to get away with (relatively free) pen and paper. Your direct competition is cheap stationery, post-its, drawing pins, and Celtx.

If what you offer is both powerful and flexible, and takes you from idea to formatted script, personally, I'd say that the upper level would be around £15-25 max, one-user multi-platform licence. But probably much less while you're establishing it. Maybe different levels, with extra facilities when you pay more. Maybe.

10 years, 12 months ago - Paddy Robinson-Griffin

Same thing goes with a lot of festivals, agencies and websites etc. Aspiring creatives are easy pickings!

10 years, 12 months ago - Peter Ward

I'm pretty sure you have to dual-deploy if your serious--iOS/Android. Hit Windows a little down the road. Though, I'm guessing a professional app developer would know the market best.

Also, I have to admit it's not clear to me what the app is trying to do. Take your fdx file and make a flow chart out of it... index card scene summaries along an arc? Some kind of histogram--ratio of action to relief scenes? For a visually-oriented app one has a hard time, em, visualizing it.

10 years, 12 months ago - Marlom Tander

Your key problem is likely to be data entry. Even if I grant that you invent an effective display that helps the user visually grasp what they need to do*, the user will have to somehow input data in a manner that allows your system to display it.

But their data is already elsewhere - in random text docs, on cards etc.

No one wants to double entry data, and a formatted script is often the last stage. By that time the writer has everything in their head, and if they need to change page 98, can instantly swing back to adjust 23,34,and 67-9 as well.

*I used to wrestle seriously large spreadsheets with macro based processing (1000+ A4 pages), and that was all done by geometrical visualisation. But I'm not sure how many writers have an explicit visual model of their script, let alone one that fits yours.

10 years, 11 months ago - Tony Brandrick

In terms of which platform to target have you asked your developers about using something like Phonegap, so you can target Windows Phone, Android and iOS from the same code base? http://phonegap.com/

10 years, 11 months ago - Ian Kennedy

Thanks guys, useful responses. I should be talking to the app company again tomorrow so plenty to fill them in on. I think the idea of compatibility with the other writing software out there is good, might be the sort of thing to give the developers kittens but it's definitely something writers would look for.

10 years, 11 months ago - Ian Kennedy

As a point of comparison, Dramatica story software retails for over $100; not the kind of money anyone would pay for an app maybe but certainly the kind of money a committed pro might spend on a tool that boosted their career. Does anyone here use or like it? The app I'm developing works in a very different way and wouldn't need a full-size computer to operate it. http://www.writersstore.com/dramatica-story-expert/

10 years, 11 months ago - Franz von Habsburg FBKS MSc

I use Final Draft Mobile on my iPad (around $25) and it is invaluable when on the move, although I tend only to edit and not write anything from scratch. It auto saves via Dropbox so the amended version is on my iMac when I get home!

10 years, 12 months ago - Dan Selakovich

I personally can't imagine using an app to help with writing. But if I did, it would have to be an iPad.

This might be a good idea, no matter what platform you use. I notice a lot of beginning writers spend small fortunes on software that they think will help them become better writers--and there are a lot out there. By the time they realize that there is no magic bullet, you've already pocketed their cash. Who was it that got rich in the gold rush days? The guys who sold the picks and shovels.

10 years, 11 months ago - Fiona Woof

I'd be interested in trialling a screenwriting/storywriting app for iOS.
For my use, it would need to integrate with Scrivener.

10 years, 12 months ago - Ian Kennedy

Nice to hear the constructive scepticism, thanks both - these are the reasons why a visually intuitive approach to story development hasn't (as far as I'm aware) been achieved before. I'm not trying to emulate or replace the software we use for actually writing things, nor do I expect anyone to give up pens and paper - I personally couldn't do without scribbled notes on the scripts I develop or do readings for. The app is a tool for breakdowns, analysis and troubleshooting, using mobile-friendly forms. I raise this discussion to ask that IF it existed and it actually was any use to a writer, what platform would you expect to use it on and how would you expect it to be costed? (We've already got some ideas of course but it's better to hear it from the community.)

10 years, 12 months ago - Marlom Tander

An APP? for screenwriting and storytelling?

I use two big monitors and that's still not enough screen space. In fact the wall in front of me has about 100 cards with notes blu tacked to it in character timeline columns.

They only sane way to develop your WRITING skills is to WRITE.

The only thing you can write on a mobile is a poem :-)

If you want people to PAY for your APP, you'll need a time limited trial for them to conclude that it does in fact help them.

Good luck

10 years, 12 months ago - Ian Kennedy

Thanks both. I'm perfectly happy for anyone to be cautious about whether such a thing is possible and viable - if it was obvious (or if I explained it) then anyone could have set this up already. Much thanks for your feedback and keep the thoughts coming.