ASK & DISCUSS INDEX

10 years, 4 months ago - Andrew Morgan

I shot my 1930's horror feature, Arkham Sanitarium on a £40,000 budget - was supposed to be £50k but that's a story for another day - besides, the shooting wasn't the hard/time-consuming part - post on the other hand...

10 years, 6 months ago - Simon Birks

It's always worth the struggle! We recently shot our feature film, Symbiote, on a 10K budget. Nowhere fancy, just in and around Sussex, UK, and it looks fantastic - just going through post at the moment, so nothing to show - but you can achieve a lot with a low budget. In my humble experience, for it to look good, interesting locations and a great DOP go a long way!

Happy to help if you want to know more.

10 years, 5 months ago - John Lubran

A really great achievement Al. I imagine though that there were a lot of freebies and fortuitous circumstances that also benefited those films? Even so, great outcomes for so little resources and definitely inspirational.

10 years, 4 months ago - Gareth Rees

Hi
I shot my feature, Written In Dust, for £5000, although I do own my Canon 5D Mk2 and iMac with Final Cut Pro. Using that camera, and paying great attention to the cinematography, I raised the quality compared to my earlier shorts. I used non-professional actors, but was very careful in my auditioning and did extra rehearsals. Everyone took part on a deferred fees basis, and I shot in Beijing, which certainly reduced catering costs :-) Also, working with that camera, which is so discreet, I often worked on live locations and avoided costs that way. I could also do that because the film is a silent film, so when the coal truck decided to park next to us I didn't have to re-shoot for sound.

I completed in 2014, but started in 2010! That's one of the main consequences for me of having no budget; it took twice as long as I'd hoped. But time and determination made up for the lack of cash, I guess. This is my Youtube channel, which has some trailers for the film: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCjgDkcsD-KppXHzm-pHTvGA
The film was selected by Edinburgh Film Guild for their New Cinema season 2014; it toured a little last year, and there are some screenings in London in November.
I'd certainly echo Al's comment about marketing budgets - I've not included that in the £5000! My film has a different distribution model in that it is a contemporary silent film, and is always screened with live music accompaniment, so I am organising tours, as if it was a theatre or live music event.

And like Andrew, I found the post production the most time consuming aspect. Not having the money to book out a good editor for one or two months really slowed things down.

Other costs I hadn't originally accounted for included the BBFC certificate and the DCP

Anyway, I like the challenge of seeing what can be achieved, to good quality, with little money, and I'm enjoying touring the film :-)

10 years, 6 months ago - Angel Delgado

Shot this feature for "low budget".
http://brothersdayfilm.com/

We did have to do a lot of deferrals, favours, etc. Had no stars, which brings your costs down (but pretty much means no chance of traditional distribution). I believe a lot can be achieved on low budget with the right script and people, some experience and a few compromises. But -depending on your goals- it may not be worth the struggle.

Hope that helps and all the best with your projects.

10 years, 5 months ago - Ben Rider

Two features done. To Love Somebody was made for £7,000, we shot it on the Canon 7D, and it can be viewed here - www.vimeo.com/ondemand/tolovesomebody, And my second, Seven Devils, was on the 1DC, but it's yet to come out.
I'd definitely recommend pushing towards the 4K mark. It's right around the corner and the industry is changing for it.

10 years, 5 months ago - Al Carretta

No Budget Indie Films - Figures And Details

Not much point in detailing these films without the full context so here's quite a long post with the links you are looking for at the bottom.

From January 2010 - June 2014 on a total spend of less than £10k I made 7 indie features to experiment with genre and learn distribution from the ground up. As far as I am aware not many UK indie directors have put this sort of portfolio together in the same timeframe and on the same budgetary limits but I do have a complete method to get things done.
I've also gone through pretty much every distribution angle there is including iTunes and the plethora of VOD options.
What makes my experience unique is this. All my films have come from stage to screen. Bar 'Automatically Sunshine' they were all presented in the Edinburgh Festival Fringe between 2002 - 2014. To me this gives them history and context
which makes them much broader 'products'. Everyone is looking for assets and the knowledge that what began as a crappy play in a pop-up theatre in a church is now a film is remotely exciting...

Stats highlight things immediately. Across 7 films I think I've used around 51 actors but the crew has maxed out at 2 at any given time. Big casts and crew mean big wastes of shooting time. People get bored making films so I've only ever shot in 4-6 hour windows. On post I've done everything, including the original soundtracks which get composed first, then produced with musicians and vocalists. If I'd ever delegated in post I would have just wasted time and money because every necessity of filmmaking can now be achieved by the director and bringing in 'post' people who aren't a match skillwise just doesn't work because you will have finished before they've even started. Also, there is a key thing that lots of filmmakers forget; if you don't own everything (e.g music), licencing becomes a department of unnecessary cost and this is just more administration.

Genre Considerations

I'm brutal on all my films. I know what's good, what's bad, where the plot cement is and how much money I didn't have to finish the scene but I know where the content aligns to be pushed. Or not as is the case with indie films. 'No budget' films are never going to be Hollywood fare until they are remade with serious money unless the genre alignment is so present in the style it sits side by side with the classics. There are practically no low budget films that have ever done this (other than the ones that spawn the genre itself) which is why I only consider my output as templates for something that can be expanded on with money. My films 'WYSIWYG' and 'The Devil Made Me Do It' are 1970s set Mafia crime drama genre movies and are by far my most saleable product because they align with a market that includes 'The Godfather', 'Goodfellas' etc.

Following this My 7th feature 'Automatically Sunshine' as a British crime drama also sets a clear genre tone for marketing but it's more 1990s ITV primetime e.g. 'The Governor' (Janet McTeer). It also passes the Bechdel test which puts it on a unique list giving it partial it niche credentials. Beyond this 'Super Tuesday' is a heavyweight b/w noir drama about the 1960 US election. Because of it's reference to the US Election it's title is effective and in remake territory with the right lead actress it's a vehicle film. Finally, these three of my films will only have a wider audience if remade with considerable more exposition. 'The Length Of Spring' (romantic tragedy), 'Africa In Her Blood' (human interest) and 'A Mass For The Dying' (psychological character study) were all great fun to make but lack the pinpoint attachments required to push them easily.

So, my ethos is this. In the current market you need 500k - £5 million to make any kind of serious marketing dent with a film (and recoup costs). If you haven't got that cash you might as well be making what you can as cheaply as possible.



Feature Films and weblinks.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3428843/

http://www.vimeo.com/nightpiecefilms

Shot Feb - May, finished June 2010.
Debut feature 'What You See Is What You Get' cost £600. ('WYSIWYG' ). Adheres to all of the 'rules' of indie film.
You can see it in full here:
https://vimeo.com/88710316


Shot Oct -Nov, finished Dec 2010.
2nd feature 'The Length Of Spring' cost less than £1200. You can see it in full here:
https://vimeo.com/91186282

Shot Jan - July, finished July 2011.
3rd feature 'Africa In Her Blood' cost around £1800. Trailer here:
https://vimeo.com/73448072

Shot Oct 2011 - July 2012, finished July 2012.
4th feature 'The Devil Made Me Do It' was less than £1800. This is a good example of what can be achieved sub £2k.
You can see it in full here:
https://vimeo.com/74017061

Shot July - Aug 2013, finished Aug 2013
5th feature 'Super Tuesday' went on stage in Edinburgh and got released online simultaneously. Film cost was
around £1000, stage show £2000. This is being screened soon so isn't currently online.

Shot Oct 2013, finished Nov 2013
6th feature-short 'A Mass For The Dying' (46mins), shot as an experiment cost less than £150 but some footage was nabbed from Africa In Her Blood.
https://vimeo.com/80586166

Shot Oct 2012 - May 2014, finished June 2014
7th feature 'Automatically Sunshine' cost less than £1000. Trailer here:
https://vimeo.com/103125204
This is being screened soon so the full version isn't currently online.

'Revolt In Hokum' (8th Feature in production)
About 50p in the budget on this one.
https://vimeo.com/111671808

10 years, 6 months ago - Vasco de Sousa

Dara Says cost us less than 5k in cash that we didn't get back (some of that 5k was crowdfunding and other donations, so I guess it cost us less still. But, assuming no one gave us any money, there'd be crowdfunding.)

If we had paid ourselves minimum wage for all the work we did, in storyboarding, crowdfunding, shooting, editing, acting, recruiting, etc, we'd have over 40k added to the budget. If we paid ourselves average graduate wages, well, you figure it out. (And that's not including screenwriting, which I'd done years before that.) I even designed the logo, the poster, etc, and the producer found a talented musician to loan us some stock music. Some people charged us less because we didn't have money. So, it really should have cost us over well over fifty k. But, we were able to make it despite not having that money.

http://darasays.com/

If you ask me as a corporate client to shoot a similar film, the budget for that film would be around 250k. We worked so much on spec it because of the potential of getting 100 percent of future profits, but if it's for someone else's project, we'd want some money up front.

Blair Witch project's business plan called for 300k dollars. The film was "in the can" apparently for 20k, but you have to get inflation into that. the business plan included promotion at the film festivals.

Again, for films from 1990s, you'll look at inflation. That said, El Mariachi only cost the film the filmmaker 7 grand out of pocket. But, I guess everyone on that must have worked for free, or deferred payment.

10 years, 6 months ago - Michael Lebor

Hi John,

I can't send you a link to the film because it's only at 1st cut stage but I recently DOP'D a feature film with a skeleton crew and a lot of borrowed kit (mostly from me!!!).

It's set in the foothills of the Alps in a big eery house, which belongs to the directors parents and that's where we all slept for 3 weeks.

It won't fail because of the extremely tight resources, it will fail if the script and story aren't strong enough and the acting is poor.

The location was lucky but getting actors and crew to work for free isn't impossible and borrowing kit is achievable. This film was shot for much less than 10k GBP.

Just write an amazing script that excites everyone!

On the other hand, I worked with the producers of Shifty who made their first film with the microwave budget scheme (I think that's the name). They raised 50k and then the scheme matched 50k.

They begged borrowed and made a great film for 100k which launched their careers.

Their next movie cost 5 million and the money came from LA. I did the behind the scenes for it - Welcome to the Punch. Although that wasn't critically acclaimed (criticised for an overly complex script and shallow characters) the producers and directors are working with Anthony Hopkins and Ben Kingsley on their next film, called Autobahn.

It can be done, in my view it takes a great script and a lot of good friends.

10 years, 6 months ago - Lee 'Wozy' Warren

Really nicely shot film Peter :)

10 years, 5 months ago - Joseph Steele

Hi John

This film https://shootingpeople.org/watch/129084/thus
Cost me £11,500

10 years, 4 months ago - Al Carretta

Thanks to John Lubran for his very positive comments above, however, in contrast to many indie films delivered cheaply we've had zero freebies and no particularly fortuitous circumstances; it's all come down to extremely careful planning and a decision to constantly adapt to the restraints of the shooting day. I shoot film the same way most people would rehearse for a theatre production but swift filmmaking only works with competent performers.

I think it's Michael Caine in his bio who says 'use the difficulty' but I've always observed the most overlooked cost consideration of them all; complete creative control. The more people you indirectly involve the greater the costs are but as an indie director I feel cost and competence sit closely together. Root out the padding in your crew and you'll work faster and more cost effectively.

A link to my last feature 'Automatically Sunshine' is below (only the trailer is linked in the previous post). I shot this for less than £1k between October 2012 and May 2014.


"British Indie deals with identity fraud in what is a very raw and understated film."

Automatically Sunshine
https://vimeo.com/119511391

10 years, 6 months ago - Simon Mercer

Kelly Reichardt's Old Joy was done for $30k (£15k) and is incredible. Sparse crew, minimal locations, well written.. it can be done. And gear has only got better and cheaper since that was filmed. Reichardt's films and reputation have grown exponentially in stature since this one.

10 years, 6 months ago - Lee 'Wozy' Warren

I suppose it all depends upon what your goals are. Based upon some of the above comments, you could shoot 10 films for 100k (10k each) and build a nice portfolio of films you have directed/produced. But obviously you're not going to get the best DoP or locations or art director etc or cast for 10k. 100k will give you more options but comes with different demands than a 10k film. So you have to ask yourself, what are my goals?

10 years, 6 months ago - Lee 'Wozy' Warren

What do you consider low budget? less than £1m, less than £100k, or less than £50k?

10 years, 6 months ago - John J Chapman

For this situation, less than £50k...

10 years, 6 months ago - Peter Spencer

http://vimeo.com/116737183 that I wrote, less than £100k also check out Blue Ruin - 90k

10 years, 3 months ago - John Lubran

Another great achievement for virtually no budget Al. However the meaning of 'freebie' and 'fortuitous circumstance' might benefit from further definition. Clearly anyone who worked on either side of the camera without proper pay is a freebie to some degree, any private domain location used for nothing will also be a freebie or fortuitous circumstance; even your own time may well be only available because some other resource allows you to invest that time, how about the music? I'm in no way trying to take away anything from your achievement of creating this really quite compelling film for so little 'out of pocket' expense because I'm absolutely sincere in my admiration of it. It's just that it's often the case that so much of those essential elements that might be taken for granted by one person represent much more of a challenge to others who are coming from a less fortunate position, whether it be just being less with lucky connections, having to scrabble for basic living needs (rent, bills, food etc.) Not having access to production and post production tools and stuff like that. There's a quantifiable minimum value for every part of the film excluding public domain resources and it must follow that any of those parts not paid for in money must be either a freebie or fortuitous circumstance.

I have no knowledge of your own background and so I'm not even vaguely suggesting the following applies to your circumstances but to contribute to the general discussion I'd even go so far as to say that a good middle or upper income family back ground represents a considerable fortuitous circumstance in terms of opportunity and access. There's an old adage about the accomplishments of wealth, I don't think that just applies to millionaires in today's parlance, many of whom will even protest their relative hardships without any sense of irony.

10 years, 6 months ago - Michael Lebor

I just watched the trailer for Iboga Nights on youtube. Looks fantastic. For 10K that's very impressive and dedicated. It's brave to take on a project with such a long timeframe. Any plans for your next project?

I'm trying to get funding to complete my current documentary project, Buddy Goes To Nollywood.

http://buddynollywood.co.uk/

Stills on the homepage and the trailer is in the menu.

10 years, 6 months ago - Peter Spencer

Cheers Lee!

10 years, 5 months ago - Jason Wilcox

A little like Al, but with a different style (all of my work is from original screenplays), I have completed 15 indie features since 2010, with an on average slightly higher budget that his. Several have been screened at festivals, most recently at the Horror-on-Sea Festival. My main challenge is getting the work known by potential audiences - I am hoping that if I get at least several hundred people viewing the trailers, I would then have the potential to recoup at least some of my budgets by making the full-length features available on vimeo-on-demand. (Which seems to be the best platform, but maybe I am wrong about this?).
Almost all of the work can be categorised as (psychological) horror/thriller/mystery.
I think there is - or ought to be - a niche market of a few hundred people in the world interested to watch my work, even though I admit the quality is variable (I am pleased with about a quarter of my output, and satisfied with another quarter, though others may disagree with me about which films are better than others, of course!). Earlier work (two features, half a dozen shorts) are not (yet) available online. Any feedback, ideas/suggestions for marketing are welcome!
Trailers can be viewed here:


https://vimeo.com/108946124


https://vimeo.com/112635718


https://vimeo.com/112716218


https://vimeo.com/112877938


https://vimeo.com/112935377


https://vimeo.com/113094267


https://vimeo.com/113122674


https://vimeo.com/113724099


https://vimeo.com/113702669


https://vimeo.com/113286148


https://vimeo.com/113704302


https://vimeo.com/114345174


https://vimeo.com/114345175


https://vimeo.com/115021063


https://vimeo.com/114350393

10 years, 6 months ago - Lee 'Wozy' Warren

Ok - good luck :)

10 years, 6 months ago - David Graham Scott

I raised about £7K from Indiegogo to finish my latest feature doc. I was filming over 3 years with my own kit and the costs of that would be around £3K for travel I guess. All in all it cost around £10K or slightly more and was well worth it I think. My documentary is called Iboga Nights and it won Best Uk Doc at a prestigious festival in London...Open City Docs Fest. That makes it well worth the effort I think. If you send me a PM or add me on Facebook (David Graham Scott) then I'll send you a secret link.

10 years, 6 months ago - cath le couteur

If you're UK based - these stats from Stephen Follows as a general overview on British Filmmaking could help:
http://stephenfollows.com/49-interesting-facts-about-uk-film-industry/

10 years, 6 months ago - Paddy Robinson-Griffin

Depends where you draw the line, really. Production? Post production? Packaging, deliverables and marketing? You could claim the Blair Witch Project was under £50k, except for the huge promotional spend, and excluding most of the post, legals, etc.

10 years, 5 months ago - James Kibbey

I wrote/directed The Last Sparks Of Sundown, super low budget, (www.thelastsparksofsundown.com). Stars Miles Jupp, Kayvan Novak, Emily Bevan, Christian McKay. Currently doing the festivals. Be happy to chat about experiences.